CHP officer & family killed

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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby cheapski » Sun Oct 18, 2009 12:36 am

Guess what?

Toyota's runaway-car worries may not stop at floor mats

The tragedy Aug. 28 was at least the fifth fatal crash in the U.S. over the last two years involving runaway Toyota and Lexus vehicles made by Toyota Motor Corp. It is also among hundreds of incidents of sudden acceleration involving the company's vehicles that have been reported to Toyota or the federal government, according to an examination of public records by The Times.

Toyota has blamed the incidents -- apart from those caused by driver error -- on its floor mats, asserting that if they are improperly installed they can jam open the accelerator pedal. A month after the Saylor crash, Toyota issued its biggest recall in company history, affecting 3.8 million vehicles in model years as far back as 2004. But auto safety experts believe there may be a bigger problem with Toyota vehicles than simply the floor mats.

The Saylor crash and others like it across the country, they say, point to a troubling possibility: that Toyota's ignition, transmission and braking systems may make it difficult for drivers to combat sudden or unintended accelerations and safely recover, regardless of their cause.

"This is Toyota's Firestone," said Sean Kane, president of Safety Research & Strategies, a Rehoboth, Mass., auto safety consulting firm. He was referring to the public relations disaster that hit Bridgestone/Firestone almost 10 years ago over defective tires that caused a series of fatal accidents.

"Right now," Kane said, "when you say sudden acceleration, Toyota is it."
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Anybody else own a "recalled" Toyota?

Postby boarddad » Sun Oct 25, 2009 3:34 pm

I own a 2008 Camry and frankly I'm shocked by Toyot'a response thus far. The only notice of a recall I've been given has been through the media. Accordingly, I removed the driver's side floormat. We took our car in for service yesterday and asked about the recall. The dealer said the floor mats are not a problem as long as they are the OE mats. Admittedly the mats didn't just slip right out - it took a little doing to unhook them, but that's NOT what has been reported in the media! IMHO, the pedal design is a huge contributing factor. Not only is it not hinged as the NTSB concluded, but it also has a little divot in the body that the pedal gets pressed into. In other words, when the pedal is fully depressed, it sits BELOW the edge of the floor mat - YIPES!

Keep in mind, Toyota has said NOTHING to us! No notice in the mail, no frantic robocall, not even so much as a recal alert at the time of servce - NOTHING! When I had a Nissan they ran a complete check every time I so much as called to schedule an oil change. It's as if Toyota doesn't believe they have a problem. Toyota better damn well get more proactive on this! Frankly removing the floormat is no solution - it's there to protect the carpet from wear...or at least it was.

As if their sharky sales techniques wasn't enough to keep me from buying another one...
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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby susylia » Thu Nov 05, 2009 5:02 pm

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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby Sierra Lady » Thu Nov 05, 2009 11:29 pm

^ Thanks for that update.
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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby SurfnSnowboard » Thu Nov 05, 2009 11:33 pm

I wonder if anyone has done a test to see what can be done to stop this model of car when the accelerator is stuck. With electronic controlled everything it's taken away some of the options that are available on older cars such as shifting into neutral or simply turning off the key.

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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby oldskier » Fri Nov 06, 2009 10:11 am

Sounds like it several models of cars. This whole thing blows my mind. After reading some of the blogs from people that had it happen to them and managed to get the vehicle back under control it seems like it may be more common than the article lets on. I wonder how many (like Ski-Bum 4 ever) took it to the dealer to have it fixed and it was never reported.
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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby boarddad » Fri Nov 06, 2009 12:30 pm

Really makes me wish I'd bought an Altima instead of a Camry :@
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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby Biker395 » Fri Nov 06, 2009 2:44 pm

Wow! I think we were the victim of an unitended acceleration inicident.

Last year, we were driving along up to Mammoth at about 65 MPH, and all of a sudden, our van went full throttle for no reason! I tried and I tried to get the accelerator off the floor, all to no avail. I was at it for at least a couple of minutes or so before I finally got everything untangled. By that time, we were going almost 70 MPH!

Do you think I should report it?
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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby snowboard247 » Sat Nov 07, 2009 1:58 am

Biker395 wrote:Wow! I think we were the victim of an unitended acceleration inicident.

Last year, we were driving along up to Mammoth at about 65 MPH, and all of a sudden, our van went full throttle for no reason! I tried and I tried to get the accelerator off the floor, all to no avail. I was at it for at least a couple of minutes or so before I finally got everything untangled. By that time, we were going almost 70 MPH!

Do you think I should report it?


are you kidding, i cant tell.
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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby theHighwayman » Sat Nov 07, 2009 7:26 am

snowboard247 wrote:
Biker395 wrote:Wow! I think we were the victim of an unitended acceleration inicident.

Last year, we were driving along up to Mammoth at about 65 MPH, and all of a sudden, our van went full throttle for no reason! I tried and I tried to get the accelerator off the floor, all to no avail. I was at it for at least a couple of minutes or so before I finally got everything untangled. By that time, we were going almost 70 MPH!

Do you think I should report it?


are you kidding, i cant tell.



I'm thinkin that's a WAY underpowered "van" ;) :D annnnd a great storyteller :lol:
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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby susylia » Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:47 pm

Today in the LA Times:

Runaway Toyota cases ignored
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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby theHighwayman » Tue Nov 24, 2009 4:58 pm

floormats HAH! :@

jist witnessed an "uncontrolable accelleration" t-DAY on the I-8 EB -- comin up the on ramp from Mollison was an older Lexus sedan movin right on up the ramp w it's brake lites ON :roll: I'm thinkin WTF?? :?

THEN

I notice the ft brakes beginnin to show smoke :o

jist as the car is almost inta the I-8 lanes it veers and leaps amd comes to a bouncin halt at the end of the onramp ON the fog line and rush hour's startin!

well -- I'm past it so I haveta "goaround" to git back -- DO so hurridly -- come up the ramp "lit" so's not to git hit mself -- stop behind the Lexus a bit and inquire of the 2 xrays astandin behind the guard rail as to what hoppened??!

gal stated thet she started up the ramp and all of a sudden the car took off by itself!!!!!! she crammed the brakes, turned OFF the key [ thisun HAD one ;) ] and slammed the gearshift inta park!! [ accountin fer the great "LEAP" I'd seen ]

floormats? this car had NO stinkin floormats!

:fubar: *I* call BS on the "floormat" issue

anyways --

earlier t-day had 2 FTs and an OOG and lunch w my bro @ Dennys in Clairmont where photog's assistant from the American Profile magazine shoot came over to say hi -- [ small world ] foxy gal [ story comin out soon ]
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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby Photoho » Tue Nov 24, 2009 7:15 pm

BS without pics of foxy gal photo assistant.
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Re: CHP officer & family killed

Postby theHighwayman » Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:10 pm

she was behind the cameras --
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File this under, "It's about f-ing time!"

Postby boarddad » Wed Nov 25, 2009 9:09 am

In today's SF Gate;

Toyota to replace 4M gas pedals that could jam
By KEN THOMAS, Associated Press Writer

Wednesday, November 25, 2009

(11-25) 06:40 PST WASHINGTON, (AP) --

Toyota Motor Corp. said Wednesday it will replace accelerator pedals on about 4 million recalled vehicles in the United States because the pedals can get stuck in the floor mats.

As a temporary step, Toyota will have dealers shorten the length of the gas pedals beginning in January while the company develops replacement pedals for their vehicles, the Transportation Department and Toyota said. New pedals will be available beginning in April, and some vehicles will have brake override systems installed as a precaution.

Popular vehicles such as the Toyota Camry, the top-selling passenger car in America, and the Toyota Prius, the best-selling gas-electric hybrid, are among those recalled. Also included is the luxury Lexus ES350, the model in a fiery fatal accident in California that focused public attention on the danger.

Toyota, the world's largest automaker, announced the massive recall in late September and told owners to remove the driver's side floor mats to prevent the gas pedal from potentially becoming jammed. The recall and extensive fix is the latest problem to confront the Japanese automaker's sterling reputation for quality during a period of rapid growth, and it prompted top executives to push for improved quality controls.

"The safety of our owners and the public is our utmost concern and Toyota has and will continue to thoroughly investigate and take appropriate measures to address any defect trends that are identified," Toyota said in a statement.

The recall includes 3.8 million vehicles, including the 2007-10 model year Camry, 2005-10 Toyota Avalon, 2004-09 Prius, 2005-10 Toyota Tacoma, 2007-10 Toyota Tundra, 2007-10 Lexus ES350 and 2006-10 Lexus IS250/350. Toyota officials said about 4 million vehicles would be covered, including new cars and trucks sold since September and others manufactured since the recall was announced.

Toyota spokesman Irv Miller said company investigators found pedal entrapment to be the major issue and the company is "very, very confident that we have addressed this issue." Miller said Toyota has found "no reason to believe that there is a problem with the electronic control systems."

Toyota spokesman Takanori Yokoi said the recall only involved vehicles in North America and did not affect vehicles in Japan. He had no estimate on how much the recall would cost Toyota. Masato Nozawa, spokesman for the Transportation Ministry, said "if similar problems are found in Japan as well, then a recall could be considered."

On Tuesday, Toyota announced a recall of 110,000 Tundra trucks from the 2000-03 model years to address excessive rust on the vehicle's frame.

The recall involving the accelerators was Toyota's largest in the U.S. It was prompted by a high-speed crash in August involving a 2009 Lexus ES350 that killed a California Highway Patrol officer and three members of his family near San Diego. The Lexus hit speeds exceeding 120 mph, struck a sport utility vehicle, launched off an embankment, rolled several times and burst into flames.

A family member in the runaway Lexus made a frantic 911 call moments before the crash, telling emergency responders that the accelerator was stuck and the driver couldn't stop the car. The call ended as someone was overheard urging others to hold on and pray, followed by a woman's scream.

In Japan, Toyota President Akio Toyoda called the fatal crash "extremely regrettable" and offered his "deepest condolences" to the California family.

Investigators with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration determined that a rubber all-weather floor mat found in the wreckage was slightly longer than the mat that belonged in the vehicle, and could have snared or covered the accelerator pedal.

The government has attributed at least five deaths and two injuries to floor mat-related unintended acceleration in the Toyota vehicles and has received reports of more than 100 incidents in which the accelerator may have become stuck. A Massachusetts-based safety consultant who has investigated the Toyota cases, however, has found more than 2,000 incidents involving 16 deaths and 243 injuries potentially tied to the Toyota gas pedals.

To fix the problem, Toyota and the government said dealers will shorten the length of the accelerator pedal on the recalled vehicles and in some cases remove foam from beneath the carpeting near the pedal to increase the space between the pedal and the floor. They said owners of the ES350, Camry and Avalon would be the first to receive notification because the vehicles are believed to have the highest risk for pedal entrapment.

Toyota plans to install a brake override system on the Camry, Avalon and Lexus ES350, IS350 and IS250 models as an "extra measure of confidence," Toyota and NHTSA said. The brake override system, commonly called a "smart brake," will ensure the vehicle will stop if both the brake and the accelerator pedals are applied simultaneously.

Toyota also plans to make the brake override system standard equipment throughout the Toyota and Lexus lineup starting with January 2010 production of the ES350 and Camry. Most new models will get the equipment by the end of 2010.

Dealers will be instructed on how to modify the pedals before the end of the year and will begin shortening the accelerators in 2010. New replacement pedals are expected to be available for some models beginning in April and will be provided even if the vehicles have already received a modified pedal under the recall.

The automaker and government regulators have been discussing a potential fix for several weeks. In late September, Toyota announced the recall and told owners to remove driver's side floor mats and not replace them until the company had determined a remedy for the problem. The automaker said unhooked floor mats or replacement mats stacked on top of the originals could lead to stuck accelerators.

In early November, Toyota issued a statement saying NHTSA had confirmed "that no defect exists in vehicles in which the driver's floor mat is compatible with the vehicle and properly secured." But in a rare rebuke, NHTSA accused Toyota of releasing misleading information about the recall, saying removing the mats did not "correct the underlying defect." Toyota said it was not the company's intention to mislead anyone.

If a vehicle accelerator pedal becomes stuck and a driver can't dislodge it, Toyota advises drivers to press on the brake with both feet and then shift the vehicle into neutral, which will disengage the transmission. The automaker says drivers should continue braking until the vehicle comes to a stop.

A driver can also try shutting off the engine or turning the key to the "ACC" position on the ignition. Drivers will not lose control of the steering or the brakes. But once the vehicle is turned off the driver won't have the benefit of power brakes or power steering. For vehicles that have a start/stop button for the engine, drivers are advised to hold the button for three seconds to turn it off.

For more information, owners can contact Toyota at 800-331-4331 or the NHTSA hot line at 888-327-4236.

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